mrsnip
Mr. Black Hat
Registered: 11-2003
Posts: 3352
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Classic Crock Productions (words of Robert Fripp)
Just got this of a mailing list. Interresting read.
> Dear friends,
>
> We have removed all titles from Classic Rock productions from the DGM
> shop per the following news from Robert, with more details below from
> Sid Smith.
>
> Inside King Crimson DVD and CD
> A statement from Robert Fripp and DGM
>
> The Inside The Music series is a "pot of gold" for Bob Carruthers &
> classic rock productions. It addresses a valuable & useful area of
> popular music studies; but in a cheap, nasty & cynical fashion that
> exploits everyone & scams the artists, the music & the fans.
>
> Bob Carruthers is a likeable, personable & slippery, evasive
> character who has upset nearly everyone whose music he has, in some
> way, presented.
>
> If transparency & accountability are two features of the ethical
> company, then Classic Rock Productions must be considered ethically
> challenged in extremis. Given my 38 years of hard experience as a
> professional within the music industry, Bob Carruthers' company would
> be better named Classic Crock Productions.
>
> Robert Fripp,
> World HQ, April 22nd 2005.
>
>
> And, from Sid Smith....
>
> Inside King Crimson
>
> In recent days I've received a number of enquiries from KC fans
> regarding a DVD entitled Inside King Crimson 1972 - 1975 and a CD,
> Inside King Crimson 1975-1979, Classic Rock Productions.
>
> Potential purchasers should understand that neither item has been
> approved nor licensed by Robert Fripp, the copyright holder of the
> music.
>
> As with many other products in this series, fans hoping to see full
> performances will be disappointed. In order to get around the
> copyright act, the DVD is marketed as a 'critical review'. In this
> context, snippets of footage under 20 seconds are deemed legal.
>
> The majority of the content is made up of critical opinions by
> journalists, musicians, etc. On the Inside King Crimson DVD there are
> 10 second bursts of music.
>
> The two bonus tracks are recycled from the John Wetton Ultimate
> Anthology, another product advertised by Classic Rock Direct. John
> did not give approval of the original release or its use on either of
> these King Crimson items. John, in common with many other artists
> featured in this series, has never received any royalties.
>
> Elsewhere, other bands and musicians are becoming increasingly
> annoyed at the kind of sharp practice that recycles small clips,
> inferior sound quality and scripts and commentary riddled with
> inaccuracies.
>
> Caravan are asking their fans to boycott this kind of material.
>
> Their manager, Mark Powell, writes "You may be aware of releases by
> CLASSIC ROCK PRODUCTIONS on both DVD and CD. The material is in
> breach of contract or simply illegal. The band have not received
> royalties. The disputed titles are, 'WITH STRINGS ATTACHED'
> and 'NOWHERE TO HIDE'.
> Despite continual objections, Classic Rock Productions continue to
> exploit these recordings. These recordings have now been passed to a
> third party, who licensed them in good faith. These releases are now
> subject to dispute."
>
> Consequently, DGM is actively taking steps regarding both Inside King
> Crimson release and urges KC fans NOT to purchase them. Whilst DGM
> understands that there is a demand for rarely seen and archive
> footage of the band, Inside King Crimson is not that product.
>
> For several months DGM has been undertaking research on producing a
> compilation of archive video footage of the band in all its
> incarnations. It is likely that the resulting DVD will include all
> the tracks mentioned on the Inside King Crimson DVD (minus constant
> interruptions and critical asides) in addition to many more
> performances, several of them seen for the first time. A full press
> release itemising tracks and performances will be announced once
> licensing and clearance negotiations have been concluded. In the
> meantime, we ask fans to be patient and to avoid the Classic Rock
> Productions.
>
> Sid Smith
> Author of In The Court of King Crimson
>
> A glance at some comments from the proud owners of Classic Rock
> Productions over at Amazon and elsewhere on the internet gives some
> clue as to what King Crimson fans can expect if the Inside King
> Crimson becomes available.
>
> "This is quite simply a con! . . . I was looking forward to seeing
> the "rare footage of Atom Heart Mother" - it lasts 10-15 seconds!. DO
> NOT WASTE YOUR MONEY!"
>
> "This set of DVD's must be a con, pure and simple. Terrible reviews
> dumbed down with no new material or insights. . .These discs are
> advertised as suitable for college students and study groups, I don't
> get the joke! Best not to buy this drivel, it only encourages more of
> the same."
>
> "Oh dear...proclaiming to be the 'definitive critical review', this
> is nothing more than a DVD of talking heads, most of whom love Pink
> Floyd just like you or I. The trouble is, you and I probably could
> have made some more interesting comments!"
>
> Inside Supertramp
> "There were little snippets of live performances by Supertramp but
> this was overshadowed by a running commentary by the reviewers. It
> lasted just 63 minutes."
>
> It is a commentary documentary and nothing more. . . The total time
> that you actually see and hear Supertramp is negligible. You're
> lucky to see about 12 minutes of fragments from past performances
> (out of 63
> minutes running time). (excerpted from prog-nose review)
>
> Inside Nirvana
> "Very poor dvd . . . no full live videos . . .just 5 seconds clip
> from MTV Live and Loud, MTV Unplugged, and Saturday night live."
>
> Inside Deep Purple
> "The criticism is along the lines of "Machine Head is good, Who Do We
> Think We Are isn't", and the revelation that Smoke On The Water is
> a "classic riff". Nothing the reviewers' commentary will be new to
> Purple fans, and indeed some is inaccurate or at least incomplete."
>
> Uriah Heep
> But the quality of performances and sound/video is quite another
> matter. . .They were omitted from previous DVD releases due to poor
> quality of sound/video or due to poor performance or because of poor
> sound mix (check the version of Lady in Black present), and now we
> get them on "Ultimate Anthology"!
>
>
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Sid
>
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> Discipline Global Mobile
> http://www.disciplineglobalmobile.com/order/
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27/4/2005, 7:42
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RitchiesHair
Unconvincing Hairpiece
Registered: 06-2004
Posts: 699
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Re: Classic Crock Productions (words of Robert Fripp)
I got that as well, the mind boggles as to how they can get away with crap like that for so long.
Is this the first time an artist has spoken out against CRaP like this?, I'd be very surprised if it was.
---
You should have stopped reading this post by now.
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27/4/2005, 9:14
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Milan Fahrnholz
Purple fan
Registered: 09-2003
Posts: 17842
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Re: Classic Crock Productions (words of Robert Fripp)
Wishbone Ash seem to have done a deal with CRP as they obviously DO have the rights on their footage and the Andy Powell and Management seem to support it(selling the DVDs over the websites, on concerts etc...).
But I´m glad Fripp spoke out against this crap, finally an artist speaks true about this robbery.
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27/4/2005, 10:16
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mrsnip
Mr. Black Hat
Registered: 11-2003
Posts: 3352
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Re: Classic Crock Productions (words of Robert Fripp)
quote:
RitchiesHair wrote:
I got that as well, the mind boggles as to how they can get away with crap like that for so long.
There is always a marked, and when music clips are less than 20 seconds, they fall under the "fair usage" part of Copyright law, hence no royalties. Just as if you quote a small part of a book, or show a snippet of a film. No royalties are to be paid.
Judging from that email (including the quotes from Amazon), it´s rip off products, designed to be sold to hardcore fans, who buys just about everything that looks official. And if CRP doesn´t pay royalties, I´d simply regard their products as bootlegs, and they will eventually be traded.
quote:
Is this the first time an artist has spoken out against CRaP like this?, I'd be very surprised if it was.
I don´t know. I rarely read interviews these days.
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27/4/2005, 10:56
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Rezi
Registered: 04-2004
Posts: 16629
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Re: Classic Crock Productions (words of Robert Fripp)
It's not the hardcore fans who are in danger, it's the casual buyers: 'Deep Purple... hmmm, I've always wanted to see them play live' and then they potentially buy these things.
For hardcore fans this stuff is take it or leave it. Especially in the days of the internet it's very easy to find out these things.
I have only seen the Rainbow one. Was it worth the money? It was expensive, but I ran across it and bought it. Did I enjoy it? With the company of a few beers, yes I did.
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27/4/2005, 14:35
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Diostillrocks
Purple fan
Registered: 09-2003
Posts: 1841
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Re: Classic Crock Productions (words of Robert Fripp)
I got this on a URiah Heep mailing list. I didn't know that they ripped off other artists.
Keith Emerson and Greg Lake have a lawsuit against CRP.
Uriah Heep seems to have a good relationship with them since CRP releases all their live videos and this Bob Carruthers does the history of each album that is remastered.
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29/4/2005, 15:27
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Milan Fahrnholz
Purple fan
Registered: 09-2003
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Re: Classic Crock Productions (words of Robert Fripp)
Mmmhhh, they must have threatened him with a sue for saying that or something there is no other explaination for this to me:
http://www.krimson-news.com/index.shtml
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6/5/2005, 14:59
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RitchiesHair
Unconvincing Hairpiece
Registered: 06-2004
Posts: 699
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Re: Classic Crock Productions (words of Robert Fripp)
Yes, Fripp said in his diary that Bob Carruthers had threatened him with a defamation suit.
I'd have thought that Uncle Bob defames himself enough with all those dodgy videos he flogs....
---
You should have stopped reading this post by now.
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6/5/2005, 15:59
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